In Temurah 25b, there is a rather telling exchange. As follows:
מתקיף לה רבא ממאי דטעמא דרבי יוחנן אם שיירו משוייר דלמא היינו טעמא דרבי יוחנן דאדם מתכפר בשבח הקדש
אמר ליה רב המנונא רבי אלעזר תלמידיה דרבי יוחנן ויתיב לקמיה דרבי יוחנן ולא אהדר ליה האי שינויא ואת אמרת טעמא דרבי יוחנן משום דאדם מתכפר בשבח הקדש
That is, on 25a, Rabbi Yochanan (A2) stated a halacha. Rabbi Eleazar ben Pedat (A3) raised an objection, based on an assumed underlying reason for Rabbi Yochanan's halacha. And lots of turbulence happens from there.
Ultimately, Rava (A4) objects that perhaps Rabbi Yochanan's underlying reasoning is different, so that the objection is without basis. Rav Hamnuna II (A3). of the previous generation and contemporary with Rabbi Eleazar ben Pedat, fills in that Rabbi Eleazar ben Pedat (A3) was the student of Rabbi Yochanan (A2), and when he objected, he objected while sitting before Rabbi Yochanan. As such, the underlying reasoning was made manifest, and Rabbi Yochanan's silence in response is evidence that Rabbi Yochanan agreed that this was his reasoning.
This is an excellent example of how knowing who the people are, and how they are related, can make all the difference in understanding the sugya. Luckily, Rav Hamnuna was there to assist.
In terms of the graphs and identities, I am a bit disappointed with the current version in PROD, in this sugya. We guessed wrong as to which Rav Hamnuna this was, and said it was Rav Hamnuna I, who was A2. Based on his interaction with Rava, Rav Hamnuna II, A3, makes a lot more sense. We also should add this explicit teacher / student relation of Rabbi Eleazar ben Pedat - Rabbi Yochanan, which is missing.
But changes are on the horizon!
מתקיף לה רבא ממאי דטעמא דרבי יוחנן אם שיירו משוייר דלמא היינו טעמא דרבי יוחנן דאדם מתכפר בשבח הקדש
אמר ליה רב המנונא רבי אלעזר תלמידיה דרבי יוחנן ויתיב לקמיה דרבי יוחנן ולא אהדר ליה האי שינויא ואת אמרת טעמא דרבי יוחנן משום דאדם מתכפר בשבח הקדש
That is, on 25a, Rabbi Yochanan (A2) stated a halacha. Rabbi Eleazar ben Pedat (A3) raised an objection, based on an assumed underlying reason for Rabbi Yochanan's halacha. And lots of turbulence happens from there.
Ultimately, Rava (A4) objects that perhaps Rabbi Yochanan's underlying reasoning is different, so that the objection is without basis. Rav Hamnuna II (A3). of the previous generation and contemporary with Rabbi Eleazar ben Pedat, fills in that Rabbi Eleazar ben Pedat (A3) was the student of Rabbi Yochanan (A2), and when he objected, he objected while sitting before Rabbi Yochanan. As such, the underlying reasoning was made manifest, and Rabbi Yochanan's silence in response is evidence that Rabbi Yochanan agreed that this was his reasoning.
This is an excellent example of how knowing who the people are, and how they are related, can make all the difference in understanding the sugya. Luckily, Rav Hamnuna was there to assist.
In terms of the graphs and identities, I am a bit disappointed with the current version in PROD, in this sugya. We guessed wrong as to which Rav Hamnuna this was, and said it was Rav Hamnuna I, who was A2. Based on his interaction with Rava, Rav Hamnuna II, A3, makes a lot more sense. We also should add this explicit teacher / student relation of Rabbi Eleazar ben Pedat - Rabbi Yochanan, which is missing.
But changes are on the horizon!
